Yasmin Vossoughian Reports : MSNBCW : April 25, 2021 12:00pm-1:01pm PDT : Free Borrow & Streaming : Internet Archive (2024)

♪♪ good afternoon, everybody. i'm yasmin vossoughian. we have a lot of ground to cover. a brand-new nbc poll grading joe biden just days before he marks his 100th day as president in office. a new breakthrough in demands for body cam phenomenally to be released in a deadly north carolina shooting.

new promises from the united states to aid in india's growing covid crisis. it is so bad, they're conducting mass cremations. i'm going to be to go dr. kavita patel who has family in india about how bad it has really gotten. the images are startling. and next hour, we have a special hour you don't want to miss. families of transgender kids considering fleeing their states due to laws aimed at their kids. i'm going to talk to a mom who may leave texas to protect her son. we want to begin with that new nbc poll released just days before president biden marks his first 100 days in office and gives his first major speech to congress. the nbc national poll shows overall 53%, just over half of american voters, approve of the job that he is doing. nbc's monica alba is in washington for us. monica, good to see you. as we break this poll out, where do americans see his strngths

and weaknesses as of this moment? >> reporter: yasmin, it's a reflection of where the president spent most of his time in the first three months or so. we see the highest marks for the coronavirus pandemic, respondents are praising his handling of the covid pandemic, getting that relief passed of course in march. you see there 69% approve of that. beneath that, slightly more than half, when it comes to the economy and uniting the country. but what we don't see really reflected here and where many of the people surveyed say they would like to see essentially more worker progress is on the issues of gun safety and immigration reform. of course these are things that the president has been focused on a parallel track. there has been a lot that he has done in terms of what he wants to do, wish lists for congress. in terms of getting legislation passed on either, those will likely be more back burner issues compared to things like infrastructure and his jobs plan which is where he is putting most of his political capital.

in terms of how this compares to his predecessors, we talk about this 100-day mark, historically it's something symbolic, a marker, a snapshot of where we are in time. most of the work in any administration likely comes in the next 3 1/2 years. in terms of former president trump at this same point, his approval rating was around 40%. he never really got above 50%. then in terms of a comparison to former president obama, you see there that he was at 61% at his 100-day mark and former president george bush was at 57%. so really a reflection there of where our country is in this poll. more than 80% of people felt that the u.s. is divided right now. but something overwhelming from everyone who participated, yasmin, that i thought was notable is what they liked the most right now about president biden, is the fact that they didn't have to worry about him as much and that he was, in their words, quote, not trump. that was something that really resonated according to our latest polling. >> we'll dig more into these

numbers at the top of the 4:00 p.m. hour. monica alba, thank you, appreciate it. in ohio protests are going on, calling for justice after 16-year-old ma'khia bryant was shot and killed by an officer. today ohio's governor mike dewine said common sense police reform should not be controversial and that a clear pathway exists to reform that democrats and republicans can in fact agree on. i want to bring in nbc's chris pollone in columbus, ohio, who is following this story for us. chris, good to see you once again. what exactly are demonstrators telling you today? >> reporter: yasmin, if real, meaningful police reform is well in reach in this country as governor dewine is asserting, i think the people who have been taking to the streets the last few days would welcome that development but i think they would be skeptical. right here in front of columbus city hall, we just had a rally that lasted two hours, it's just breaking up, just a few people

left here. take a look some video we shot earlier of this rally. this one was billed a little different, it was billed as a family friendly rally. what you had out here today were lots of families were small children coming out, making signs. they were singing songs. they were doing protest chants, all in a sign of support for ma'khia bryant and for the investigation that's going forward, calling for police reforms here in the city of columbus after that 16-year-old girl was shot by police as it appeared she brandished a knife, trying to attack another girl. i asked several of the families who were out here with little children why they came out. you know, a beautiful sunday afternoon, a lot of things they could be doing, why they took their families out here to come down to a protest. here is what some of them told me. >> i want them to know that because of our skin color, no matter what's happened, our skin color gives us privileges that people with brown skin, black

skin, they don't have. they have a safety that people with darker skin don't have. and i want them to grow up understanding that and using that to fight for those who can't fight for themselves. >> reporter: so that was the tenor and nature of this protest. a lot more subdued, a lot more family friendly. and so this is what's been going on for the last six days, people have been taking to the streets. of course the investigation is ongoing. the state of ohio is in charge of that now. the attorney general leading the bureau of criminal investigations to take a look into the shooting to see if it was justified. but the protesters who were taking to the streets say, number one, they don't believe that that 16-year-old girl had to be shot and killed in that manner during that incident. and they say this is a long-running, systemic problem in columbus that goes beyond this event, yasmin. >> talking about the training in

de-escalation. chris pollone, thank you. in virginia, body cam footage is being released of victim isaiah brown. he called 911 in a dispute by his brother. he threatened his brother while suggesting he has a gun. brown tells the dispatcher twice that he does not have a gun. brown was unarmed and holding a phone when he was shot ten times. the same spotsylvania county sheriff's department who shot brown had given him a ride home after his car broke down just moments before that 911 call. viewers should be warned this video is disturbing. >> show me your hands! drop the gun! he's got a gun to his head. drop the gun now! stop! stop!

[ sound of gunfire ] >> brown sustained serious but non-life-threatening injuries and is expected to recover. the deputy is on administrative leave. his name has not been released. then we go to elizabeth city, north carolina where the sheriff there has announced he's taking steps to make body cam video public in the deadly shooting of andrew brown jr. the announcement comes in the wake of widespread protests and calls for transparency. deputies there were attempting to execute a warrant when they shot and killed brown. seven deputies have been placed on administrative leave as the incident is being investigated. josh shaffer, reporter at "the raleigh news and observer," thanks for joining us once again. the sheriff said the video would not be released because doing so could hinder the investigation. he now is saying once he has confirmation from the ag that the footage will not in fact undermine the probe, he wants to file the motion for its release. what does he mean when he says

this and what do you think has sparked this change? >> he's under enormous amount of pressure. i think that the law is different here, only a judge can release body cam footage. it's technically not a public record. but there are hundreds of people in the street every night, hollering for more information. they knew this man personally. they want to know what justified this level of violence. they counted as many as 14 shell casings on the ground. the governor of north carolina has said that footage needs to be out. so i don't think he has any choice. but the technicality is that a judge has to be specifically asked by the law enforcement agency, which he has said he will do on monday. so everything is anticipating that. >> so we're expecting, then, this motion to be filed on monday. so when could we feasibly see the body cam footage released? >> it could be as early as tomorrow, it's not a complicated process, it just has to be

formally done. >> okay. do you know if the family will be able to get this video before the public has any access to it? >> i do not know that. if theywanted to, that's a whole other set of procedures, they could show it to the family members. so far they haven't done that. >> does the judge need to grant permission for the family to see the body cam footage as well? >> no, that's another technicality. the family can see it through the law enforcement agency, they just can't take it with them. i've experienced that before, they'll have a limited viewing for only a few people. and that could be done. but as far as i know, they are seeking widespread release. >> all right. josh shaffer, we appreciate you keeping us up to date on this and abreast of the developments. good to see you, once again. to maricopa county, arizona, it seems to be a time warp, to say the least. ballots from the 2020 presidential elections are once again being recounted.

republicans in the state senate who still insist there was election fraud have hired a private company to count votes. democrats in the state fear no one is monitoring the recount and is fighting back in court. earlier today msnbc spoke to the chairwoman of the arizona democratic party. take a listen. >> it is very nervewracking just to know that our ballots, 2.1 million ballots, are in the hands of people who believe the election was stolen. and that's why the democratic party brought forth a lawsuit, because we want to make sure that if this is going to be moving forward, which it shouldn't, that there are procedures, that there are trainings, that there are policies. >> we do need to point out there is no evidence to back up the republicans' claims of fraud. and even if you could change arizona's results, it still would not be enough to give trump a victory. coming up in our next hour, i'm going to be joined by

adrienne elrod and curt bardello, you don't want to miss that conversation. still ahead, possible progress on new talks with iran. new reporting on whether the biden administration is open to a deal on sanctions and how america's ally israel could impact negotiation. plugs the sight of former police officer derek chauvin taken away in cuffs was cheered as a victory by activists. but what about the other officers there, and the legal fate that awaits them? we'll be right back. i'm ordering some burritos! oh, nice. burritos?! get a freshly made footlong from subway® instead. with crisp veggies on freshly baked bread. just order in the app! ditch the burgers!

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how much you can save. welcome back, everybody. a 61-year-old asian man is in critical condition after a brutal attack in new york. we want to warn you, the footage is quite graphic. the video shows an unidentified man push the victim from behind and kick him repeatedly in the head, pounding him, actually, as you see there. the nypd's hate crimes task force is investigating the incident to authorities work to determine -- wow, that is just devastating to watch -- determine if it is racially motivated. no arrests have been made but police are asking for anyone with information about the attack to come forward. a short time ago crews found the wreckage of the indonesian

submarine. officials say based upon the evidence, all members of the crew died on board. we're following breaking news out of iraq where at least 82 people have been killed by a large hospital fire. eyewitnesses there tell investigators that an exploding oxygen tank inside the hospital started the blaze. at least another 110 people are injured. a spokesman saying the fire spread quickly due to flammable materials in the intensive care unit and a lack of smoke detectors there. we're also learning the hospital was being used as a facilitate dedicated to covid-19 patients as cases there have in fact been spiking. coming up, everybody, we have a lot more ahead. a protest set to start shortly in wisconsin as an officer investigating the deadly shooting of jacob blake returns to work. we'll be right back. the lexus is. all in on the sports sedan. lease the 2021 is 300 for $369 a month for 36 months. experience amazing at your lexus dealer.

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the u.s. has begun laying out what sanctions it may be willing to lift and what it needs from iran to go back to the 2015 agreement. "the wall street journal" reports two people familiar with the matter says the u.s. is open to lifting terror sanctions against iran's central bank, its national oil and tanker companies and several key economic sectors. i want to bring in a senior fellow at carnegie endowment. thanks for joining us on this, really appreciate it. it seems as if they're motoring on with these negotiations when it comes to getting back into the jcpoa. i want to read from ned price, state department spokesperson, talking about the progress they've made so far. and he said this. when it comes to iran, there have been some signs of progress but i wouldn't want to overstate it. i think what i said yesterday certainly remains true that we probably have a long road ahead of us than we do in the rearview mirror at this point. talk about the dynamics of this

situation and the negotiations so far, kareem. >> yasmin, i think the iranian ghost knows the biden administration is committed to reviving the jcpoa. at the moment iran is trying to reduce as much sanctions as possible. a lot of these sanctions that iran wants relief from are not pegged to iran's nuclear ambitions, they're pegged to iran's support for, quote unquote, terrorism, iran's human rights abuses. it's going to be a little challenging for the biden administration in the context of domestic u.s. politics to justify sanctions relief. i remain optimistic we'll see either full or partial revival of the deal sometime in 2021. >> but in negotiating the jcpoa, what interest does the u.s. have

on relieving sanctions on iran ahead of any kind of solid negotiation? >> i think the bottom line is that president biden sees himself really as a domestic american president, meaning his big ideas, his big agenda, big-ticket items are domestic. whether it's fighting social injustice in the united states, economic disparity. and after two decades when he was a senator, senator biden and vice president biden trying to bring about reconciliation in the middle east, iraq, and afghanistan, he's simply not interested in escalation with iran or potential conflict in the region. and so i think for that reason he is committed to trying to revive this deal, even though, frankly, a lot of iran's challenging behavior, whether

it's its support for groups like lebanese hezbollah, the opposition to israel, none of that behavior has changed but it's simply a sign that the united states under president biden is looking to downsize its commitments in the middle east. >> let's talk about, quickly, here, israel's role in all of this, as quick as we can. we have a headline from "the new york times," a blackout hits iran nuclear site in what appears to be israeli sabotage. even with that happening, iran continuing on with these negotiations. in vienna, axios essentially saying israeli officials will object to restoration of iran deal in d.c. visit. israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu stressing rejection of a return to the 2015 nuclear deal. despite all the actions of israel going forward, it seems as if the united states and iran are persisting in these

negotiations. what does this mean for u.s./israeli relations? >> i think israel is going to remain a stalwart ally for the united states. members of congress continue to feel passionate about israel's security. israel views iran as an existential threat. they're within missile range of iran, in contrast to the united states. one of iran's slogans is "death to israel," some of iran's leaders deny the holocaust. it's natural that israel wants to do everything in its power to counter iran's nuclear ambitions. but for the united states that complicates things. israel's use of sabotage and assassination of iranian nuclear scientists complicates the u.s.'s ability to negotiate a deal. >> karim, thank you so much. a rally is expected to begin in kenosha, wisconsin.

at issue, the officer who shot jacob blake seven times is back on the beat. he was on administrative leave since august. nbc's cal perry is in kenosha and is following this for us. good to see you, my friend. what is the police department saying about the officer returning to work? >> reporter: the investigation was completed in january, so nobody here i think is surprised that the officer is back on duty. but people are obviously disappointed. the statement from the chief of police, officer sheskey was not charged with any wrongdoing. he acted within the law and was consistent with training. although this incident has been reviewed at multiple levels. i know that some will not be pleased with the outcome. it will be difficult here for people on the ground for kenosha for obvious reasons. this was an incredibly graphic shooting, seven times in the back. it has left jacob blake paralyzed from the waist down, which is why today, in the next hour or so we'll see his father as well as protesters making their way about a half mile down

this direction to the police station. there will be a number of speeches. people here will say they're not surprised, they're incredibly disappointed. they will point at things like the george floyd justice in policing act as something that needs to happen to try to prevent these incidents from happening in the future. >> cal perry, good to see you, thank you. we learned this weekend that derek chauvin will be sentenced june 16 for the murder of george floyd. this summer will also see the trial of the three former officers now facing counts of aiding and abetting floyd's murder. we want to bring in nikema armstrong, thanks for joining us. i want to talk through the aftermath of the conviction we saw this past week. and specifically let's start with the sentencing that i mentioned, getting that sentencing in mid-june. let's remind folks the charges here, second degree unintentional murder, up to 40 years in prison. third degree murder, up to 25 years in prison. second degree manslaughter, up to 10 years in prison. convicted guilty on all three

counts. it's important to note only the second-degree murder charge is relevant to this sentencing. i do need to mention, though, prosecutors are seeking a harsher sentence than recommended, arguing that george floyd was, quote, particularly vulnerable. what are we expecting here, nikema, in this sentencing of derek chauvin? >> it's really hard to say at this point. we know that prosecutors have pushed for the judge to apply aggravating circ*mstances because this heinous crime happened in the presence of children. think about the fact that it was a young child, under 10 years old at the time. my hope is that derek chauvin gets sentenced to 25 years or more, which is much more than someone convicted the second-degree murder [ inaudible ]. >> so we got the three

additional officers who were seen in the video, charged with aiding and abetting the murder of george floyd, to be tried in august. how is the verdict in the derek chauvin case, how is that going to affect these three subsequent cases, if at all? >> well, it's rolled into one. in that case the prosecutors have the burden of proving that these officers aided and abetted derek chauvin [ inaudible ]. if there had not been a [ inaudible ], [ inaudible ]. there is a strong likelihood that all three will be convicted. at a minimum, prosecutors will have to explore each of their roles in the murder. >> in your purview, a strong likelihood that each of these three would in fact be

committed. with that in mind, i want to read for you a "washington post" op-ed from andrea benjamin. people can accept that reform happens slowly if they see signs that the system will hold people accountable at the most basic level. an acquittal for chauvin would have been devastating, deflating pushes for change across the country. the verdict is not an opportunity to celebrate. floyd is still dead, the system is still broken. but incremental progress is in fact possible in minneapolis and elsewhere. what would the conviction of these three additional officers mean for the police reform movement, nikema? >> i think it is important for all three of these officers to be convicted, one, because they need to pay the price for what they did, but two, it will send a message to other officers that

they will be held accountable when they participate in murder, which is exactly what they did. a lot of times people like to say, oh, there are good officers and bad officers. but these officers are showing that even standing watch, even helping to hold somebody's body down, that doesn't make you a good officer. that makes you an accomplice to murder. and so my hope is that this will cause a paradigm shift to begin to happen within the minneapolis police department and police departments around the country. we also must give credit to the people who are boots on the ground, the activists and organizers who from the very beginning stood their ground and pressured the system to deliver accountability or what some people might call justice. >> nikema levy armstrong, thank you, good to see you on this sunday. the divide on whether voting in america should be easier or harder is deeper than ever. the percentage of republicans

who say voters should be able to vote early or absentee without a reason plummeted from 57% three years ago to 38% now. msnbc's mehdi hasan spoke to senate majority leader chuck schumer. >> the for the people act needs to be passed right now and if even one elderly member of your caucus, god forbid, were to pass away or to be incapacitated, you would no longer be majority leader. so time isn't on your side. >> i agree we to move quickly. i would say the deadline for s-1 is a little longer than you say, but probably by august or so. we're consulting with experts what's the latest that s-1 can undo some of the despicable and frankly racist changes that republican legislatures have made or trying to make in the

way people vote. >> tonight, you can watch more of that interview with senator schumer as he joins mehdi hasan live on msnbc. ahead, potential new hope in the dire situation as the coronavirus ravages the country with a second wave. >> i have a message for the government. please do something and please, oxygen for life. people need it here. people need beds here. people needs medicine here. >> new efforts to help from vaccines to medical equipment. dr. kavita patel will join me next with her personal connection to this ongoing crisis. we'll be right back. back. the bowls are back. applebee's irresist-a-bowls all just $8.99.

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batters its hospitals. india recorded 355,000 cases of coronavirus on saturday alone, a new all-time high for the country. it's facing a crippling oxygen shortage, buckling health care system. the death count has forced the country to deploy mass cremations. sky news' alex crawford has more. we want to warn you some of these images might be disturbing. >> reporter: the emergency room of one of delhi's biggest hospitals. they're constantly having to move out the dead to make way for more. and most of those in this room are dying. they haven't been admitted yet to the hospital. the doctors are simply overwhelmed, scrambling for oxygen and reduced to begging for help on social media. india set a worldwide record nobody wants. for a second day running, it topped the number of global

daily coronavirus cases. they're shocked and ashamed at how the country's health care system is all but breaking. the weak and ill have spilled out onto the pavement outside and there's no dignity in death here. the final few breaths taken by this man came after his brother had begged for oxygen for him for six hours. some turned up barely able to walk. only to turn around immediately after being told they would be better off trying elsewhere. whilst this family brought their mother. they saw her die minutes after reaching what they hoped was help. this hospital is useless, she's shouting. but it's not isolated in its inability to cope right now.

only grief is here in abundance. distraught relatives found no beds, little oxygen, fewer staff, and even less hope. india is now home to the world's fastest-growing coronavirus crisis with virus mutations which seem resistant to the vaccines. they seem unable to control it and unprepared to deal with it. alex crawford, sky news in delhi. >> wow. let's bring in msnbc medical contributor dr. kavita patel. that is shocking, some of that video, the daughter screaming out for her mother. dr. patel, i know you have family there, you've been in communication with them. what have they been telling you? >> well, yasmin, it's far worse than you can even imagine. families begging and asking for us to send medications we take for granted now, not even the

more complicated ones like remdesivir or things you need a hospital for but even just basic steroids. desperation all the way around to get oxygen, compressors, oxygen tanks. i think everybody knows there's no hospital that doesn't have family, friends, and physicians that say they're exhausted. a friend of mine who is a surgeon there said it's 20 days before they think they can even have a bed that has oxygen supply, and that they're rationing the oxygen for the people in the hospital and trying to rotate it between several hours for patients. we've talked about possibly needing to do that in the united states, never had to do it quite at that level. india is doing this now and it's becoming a regular part of care. >> when you hear the number 350,000 coronavirus cases on saturday alone, my instinct is, that seems low. >> yes, your instinct is right.

look, we know in the united states that we were undertesting and didn't have an accurate count on cases, which has borne out to be true. that is certainly the case in india. by the way, to get a test, i just got off social media with a cousin's friend who is desperately trying to get one of those pcr tests. they've been told it will take six days to get the test and then about a week to get the results. and some hospitals are now saying, we won't do the test, if you want to even be evaluated, you need to come in with proof of a positive pcr test. so the world's largest democracy has been left in kind of shambles. i'm glad the u.s. is stepping up. but it's a reminder for me, we've talked a lot about vaccine nationalism and how we really do need this to be a global approach. i'll just say that our withdrawal from the world health organization and our inability of the previous administration

to fully embrace its role in the worldwide ending of this pandemic is haunting us to this day. >> let's talk about that disparity. when you take a look at the numbers, 41% at this point of americans have received at least one dose of the covid vaccine. you compare that to india, where that number is at 8.5%. 8.5% of india has received at least one dose of the covid vaccine. and again, you talk about the disparity in reporting, who knows if that number is even accurate. how do you bridge that gap? >> yeah, it's really tough. look, the united states should and can export excess vaccines. let me be clear, vaccines today are not going to do anything to what is probably a million cases a day in india. but it is important. you bridge the gap by helping export raw materials.

india, ironically, yasmin, previous to covid, is the country's largest exporter of manufacturing for drugs and pharmaceuticals, because they just do have the ability to make drugs and vaccines as well. they've got a shortage of raw goods. they have to stop exporting the vaccines they're making to other countries. and then they really do need to focus on the basics. some places are in lockdown. but honestly, yasmin, it's still chaos. they just don't have any public health response in place. and they're literally leaving it up to people on whatsapp and social media to find assistance within a hospital. so we need to have kind of policy aid that comes forward with some of the basics as well, and probably boots on the ground coming from any country possible. >> yeah, because it seems as if at this point who knows how long this would even persist, this newest wave in india, without kind of a worldwide

participation in helping stop the spread of covid in india as of this moment. dr. kavita patel, thank you as always, so good to see you on this sunday. coming up, everybody, shining a spotlight on how the closing arguments in the chauvin trial shaped the verdict. after the break, joyce vance is joining me to break down the trial's last days and the long term effects it could have on policing and the fight for justice. we'll be right back. (vo) conventional thinking doesn't disrupt the status quo. which is why t-mobile for business uses unconventional thinking to help your business realize new possibilities. only one 5g partner offers unmatched network, support, and value-without any trade offs.

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welcome back. in the spotlight this week, watching the chauvin trial with an expert's eye throughout the trial, we've often been lucky enough to have former u.s. attorney joyce vance break things down for us. this week was a master class as joyce joined fellow former u.s. attorney preet bharara. they dissected what went wrong in the defense's closing arguments. listen to this. >> the defense tried a couple of gambits and they just didn't work. nelson resorted to i'll just say cheap shots, i don't mean that in that sense necessarily, but he is throwing some spaghetti on the wall and hoping something would stick in the mind of one juror. >> by the way, i keep hearing that phrase used and the characterization made, and i guess it's meant partially as a criticism, but it's not really, because the goal is --

>> no, it's not at all. >> you throw five strands of spaghetti at the wall, maybe one juror likes one strand, another juror likes another strand. it's a terrible strategyself-de. but he said at one point, i know i'm long winded. i think self-depprication is a good thing but maybe don't crystallize things like that for folks? >> joining me is joyce vance, former u.s. attorney and msnbc contributor and brand-new co-coast of the cafe insider podcast. can you throw one my way maybe? >> i think two is about the max. i really enjoy doing #sisters in law and now insider with preet, two very different podcasts but i'm going to say two is the limit for now p. i'm sure you're getting a lot of knitting done, too, while doing these podcasts. you're often an avid knitter as

you engage in a lot of these conversations. walk me through some of the shows. we heard a bit of your dissection of the defense in the closing arguments but what were some of the standout moments for you? >> so it's important to remember that the defense's job isn't to prove that the defendant is innocent. it's just to create reasonable doubt in the minds of the jurors about whether the prosecution has proven its case. and that's what the defense lawyer tried to do here. he focused very heavily on the issue of causation and tried to convince the jury that there were other causes that were -- that the most important cause of the death that happened here. the problem that he had was that george floyd, by the end of the testimony, the prosecution had clearly established that officer chauvin, former officer chauvin's conduct was certainly the most important cause and

likely they had convinced the jury that, but for chauvin's actions, mr. floyd would not have died. which is the legal standard that the prosecution had to meet. so it was just a tough argument for the defense to make here. >> i want to talk -- you mentioned the jury. i want to talk a little bit about the identities or lack thereof the jurors and this idea of an anonymous jury. some critics of it essentially saying, in "usa today," anonymous juries continue to be rare accounting for only around a dozen a year out of more than 100,000 jury trials. it's been a slow and constant march towards this and if in the end no one knows who is on the jury, people can lose faith in the system and see it as a faceless machine. this was said by gregg leslie, executive director of the first amendment clinic. what do you make of this idea of masking the identities of the jurors specifically in a monumental case like this? and do you think it sets a

precedent for other cases like this? >> so i understand mr. leslie's point. by and large we disclose the identities of juries in this country, although it's not unprecedented for juries to keep jurors anonymous for some period of time in cases where jurors are at risk if their identity is disclosed. for instance in a mafia prosecution. that's precisely what happened here. and in the judge's order which he entered just recently, continuing to keep the jury anonymous, he referenced the fact that the lawyers on both sides have received a lot of threatening communication. and yasmin, as a prosecutor, i was in the position of receiving those threats a time or two. it's not very much fun. we certainly shouldn't impose that on jurors who are simply trying to fulfill their civic obligation. so i don't think any longlasting precedence is set by preserving the anonymity of this jury a little bit longer in order to protect them. >> what type of impact do you think this case is going to have

on policing in this country? >> this is an important case. this is a conviction, however, in a case where the evidence was very, very clear. i don't think you heard anyone commenting and saying they didn't believe the prosecution had made its case. the concern is that in the overwhelming majority of police excessive force prosecutions, juries don't convict or don't convict on the most serious charges. many cases are never even indicted. so hopefully this case signals a new era where juries are better able to listen to the evidence and render a fair verdict. >> joyce vance, thank you. next time i miss -- i'm in mississippi, i'm making a drive over to alabama to see you. that is for sure. >> excellent. >> tune in to joyce on the cafe insider podcast. new episodes drop every single tuesday. also doing this every single week. let me know what podcast you

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welcome back, everybody. i'm yasmin vossoughian. signs of hope on capitol hill today that a police reform bill may actually happen with one republican senator at the center of things. >> i do not believe is acting on his own. he is acted with the approval and support of his leadership. >> so you think there's a pretty good chance by may 25th you'll have a deal in. >> yeah, i hope so. tim is the leader on this. his package is bipartisan. >> and a new nbc poll has good news for president biden as he prepares for his 100th day this week. in a speech to congress, his administration is framing as a victory lap for what they've accomplished so far. >> he is someone who i have seen over and over again make

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